Hello Everyone, I have never done chainmaille but I am interested. I would like to try a Byzantine bracelet. The more I read the more confused I become. I understand that AR is very important and I think I know how to calculate AR. When I read something else it gets me totally confused all over again. I have gone to numerous sites and each one will give you something different for the same weave (understanding that different people like things in different sizes).
Some sites don't tell you if they're using AWG or SWG. Once again, I get confused. I have gone to numerous sites from the earlier post here in this forum. As soon as I think I got it, I realize I'm still confused. I came across a site for jump rings which gave the outside diameter of the rings. Are they talking about the thickness of the gauge? I don't know if I'm saying that right.
Is it the thickness of the wire?
Can someone make it a little more simple and help me understand what I'm not understanding?
Maybe I need to buy a kit until I can figure out what and why i'm [banghead]so confused.
Thanks in advance,Donna

Ok - here is one thing that should help.....AR is the same regardless of wire use. If the AR is 3, it's always 3 regardless if you're using sterling, gold, stainless, fence wire, etc...

As far as rings:

Most chain maille sites give the ID, the inside diameter of the ring; unfortunately most places (other than chain maille sites) that sell rings measure the outside of the ring. If you're going to buy rings, stick with the chain maille sites: blue buddha, urban maille, golden maille, spider chain to name a few. I really like these vendors for a few reasons - first and foremost, I support women in business, they will help you and answer as many questions as you have to ask and, most importantly their products are first rate - no dirty rings, no crazy high shipping...

Donna:

To jump in and get your feet wet, you might want to purchase a kit from one of the sites Karen suggested. Most kits have the instructions and rings needed for the weave together for one price, you just supply the tools and patience. *grin* Try a couple of kits, read all the info these helpful sites have and you will start to get a feel for what you are doing. Learning how to weave maille is fun but can be mind boggling at the same time. *grin* Ask lots of questions and give yourself plenty of time and patience and you will get the hang of it. Oh, and yep...lots of reading.

Have fun!

Here's a link to Urban Maille.
www.urbanmaille.com

They have kits to get you started if you really need help. I started chainmaille by taking a class at my LBS and I was instantly hooked. Be warned, all the hours of putting rings together takes a toll on your hands, so I recommend spending the money and buying Lindstrom pliers on the Urban Maille site if you become a serious maille addict.

Welcome to the maille club! [<]

Yes, get a kit to start. Once you have done a piece from a kit, it's easier to understand how to do one from scratch and everything else you read will make a whole lot more sense.

After you've got one piece under your belt, buy just the rings from one of the sites loopy mentioned, and make the same thing again only maybe use a different size ring with the proper aspect ratio, so you can compare the results you get with different size rings in the same weave. I highly recommend Spiderchain for rings - when you place your order you can tell her what you are planning on making and she will logic-check it for you to make sure you are getting the right size and right amount of rings. And if you need some learning assistance, her DVDs are top-notch and worth EVERY penny.

Yes, invest in good pliers. And do some stretches and bends to warm up the muscles of your hands before you start, and every 20 minutes or so. Ditto your neck and shoulders.

Good luck, have fun, and show us what you make!

If you want to try Byzantine, I've found that 18swg 5/32" sterling silver rings from The Ring Lord (www.theringlord.com) work great. I pre-tumble my rings because it's my experience that if you start with nice, shiny rings, your finished product will be so much better.

I don't want to slag off Urban Maille because their website is a terrific resource, their prices on Lindstrom RX pliers are excellent and their customer service is second to none. However, I do think their kits are a bit on the spendy side and there are less expensive options out there. Of course, this is just my opinion - if you can afford the Urban Maille kits, I don't think you'll be disappointed.

Donna,

I make a lot of Byzantine bracelets. I make the jump rings myself. For a tight chain I use these size mandrels.
14 ga wire I use a 5.4mm mandrel
16 ga 4.5mm
18 ga 3.7mm

I make the 14 ga. size the most. I took my calipers to the hardware store and started measuring nails and rod stock. The only thing I found in 5.4mm was a display hanger. They found an unused one and took it off of the display wall for me.

Steve

I went to all the sites and printed lots of charts. Did a lot of reading last night. I e-mailed Spider with some questions and got them answered. I'm understanding a little bit of what I didn't understand. Math was never a good subject for me and I think I was getting hung up with all the fractions and mm's. I think I'll start with a kit to give me an idea of what it's like and then work from there. I'm sure I'll like maille. Just need to make sure to rest my hands with carpal tunnel in both wrists.
Thank you to all of you for your suggestions. They were helpful and I'll let you know how I make out. BTW, I did order Spider's DVD's.
Donna

Donna, Spider's DVDs are AWESOME and 100% worth the money. After you do the kits, if you have carpal tunnel, you are going to want to invest in some Lindstrom RX pliers. They are worth the money also. Especially if you get hooked on maille...which, uh, is pretty easy to do. *cheesy grin*

Have fun!!!

- Jennifer

I bought Spider's bracelet DVDs from RINGLORD.COM after trying unsuccessfully to figure out some free tutorials on the web without success. I even bought a book off Amazon.com and couldn't figure out the directions.
After 5 MINUTES with her DVD, I MASTERED european 4-in-1 which has been giving me the FLUX for a month!

$25 for the DVD is SOOOOOOOOOOOOO worth it!
Angela
PS I agree about the Lindstrom pliers - START with those! They are the bomb! I have to replace mine, they both broke at the same time [:(] Been using them too much I suppose LOL
--A

Donna-
I was in the same boat as you are when I started. I did alot of reading and got so confused, but couldn't wait to start ! While I waited for the good stuff to arrive. I had a ton of the little (about 4mm) cheap ( $3.99 a pack of 144) rings from Michaels or Hobby Lobby that i used for my first Byzantine try. I didn't worry about the AR or how it may turn out I just wanted to get the motions down, opening and closing the rings, how I held the pliers, which sizes worked best for my hands, etc. The weave was loose so it made all the connections easy and it made me realize that I did like what I was doing. and it didn't look to bad and I will confess that I do wear it instead of the more recient silver ones on occasion.
good luck!
another Donna

Thank You All so much for answering my post. It's means a lot when you have some place to turn for feedback. Today I am anxiously awaiting the kits I ordered from Spider. I ordered the 14g byzantine for my husband and 18g for myself. Looking at different tutorials for 1 and 2 connectors (still not sure what the difference is) I'm glad I just ordered the kits. I was afraid if I just ordered the rings and used the free tuts. it might not work. I have also looked at the Lindstrom pliers. Not only will they be worth the cost but if you buy good tools to begin with you shouldn't have to buy twice. Now, I'll probably receive the kits and still have to wait for the pliers. I do have some copper wire so maybe it is a good idea as you say to just get the feel for opening and closing the rings properly. Hopefully in the not too distant future I can post and show you how they turned out. Thanks again.
Donna

Hi Donna I have re-bumped a thread that has great info about Chainmaille in it...

I did notice the link for the tumbling info...is not good any more I will re post it

diane

Here is the correct link to the tumbler info the one in the other post is not valid anymore

http://urbanmaille.com/articles.asp?id=148

I will post it in that thread too

When I first started chainmaille the whole aspect ratio confused the heck outta me, here's what I've learned since then... Knowing the Aspect Ratio for a weave and how to convert it to another gauge allows you to keep the same density of a weave using another gauge (so make sure you like the density of the weave that you use to calculate the aspect ratio!).

aspect ratio = interior diameter of ring ÷ wire thickness

I'm about to start on a loop-in-loop necklace right now so I'm going to do the conversion for that instead of a chainmaille weave ... for any of you other loop-in-loopers it's one way single

aspect ratio = 6.35mm ID ÷ .64516mm for 22 ga wire
aspect ratio = 9.84

Instead of using 22ga wire I want to use 18 gauge wire for this necklace, so here's how to do the conversion ... (we already know the Aspect Ratio from the equation above)

Interior Diameter of Ring = Aspect Ratio x Wire Thickness
Interior Diameter of Ring = 9.84 AR x 1.02362mm for 18 ga wire
Interior Diameter of Ring = 10.07mm (I'm gonna use a 10 mm mandrel)

Hopefully that was pretty straight forward. It might help to check out UrbanMaille's weave gallery. They've made and photographed the same weave in a variety of gauges, so this is a good visual of what using these formulas can do for you. Here's the general weave gallery http://urbanmaille.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=47 and here's the one for Byzantine http://urbanmaille.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=48. You'll find that there are a ton of combinations for the same weave, what you like depends on how dense or tight you want the weave. My personal favorite for Byzantine is 3/32" ID in 18ga wire.

Happy mailling! [:D]
Mollie