I'm with many of you...only the real deal will do. Being in Tucson, most of my customer base is quite savvy on gemstones (at least more than the average office worker!). One difference I can attest to is that some types of treatments are "acceptable" to them such as heat. Dying is only for the "fun" stuff (IOW "cheap"). Chalk turquoise is NEVER acceptable and I've yet to see any of the stabilized stuff that will satisfy Arizona customers. An earlier poster mentioned Sleeping Beauty turquoise and, luckily, my turquoise buyers are willing to spend for quality turquoise. Tibetan and Kingman turquoise are pretty good too.

Whether you make your jewelry out of the real stuff or fakes is up to you. You have to ask yourself, "Do my customers care if it's real or not?" But more importantly, do you care if it's real or not? It is, afterall, YOUR work. ;)

QUOTE: Originally posted by bodhikt >>Also listed were some alternative sources for gems-- diamonds from Canada (?) that were put there by a glacier was one. Does anybody have this list?

I can't give you the list but an alternate source of diamonds is definately Canada -
http://www.nrcan.gc.ca/mms/diam/index_e.htm
Some people argue that even Canadian diamonds could be considered partially unethical as large amounts of the lands that these diamonds are mined from are: 1. native lands that are being sold to large companies, and 2. not mined in an environmental sensitive manner (as generally diamond mining is strip mining and also has large amounts of toxic runoff). These comments are not necessarily entirely true but should be mentioned. That being said I believe that the Canadian diamonds are a lot more ethical than any mined in South Africa.

Thanks for the link, Meresea... to my eyes that's a very fascinating government article. It's interesting that they want to go out of their way to demonstrate that 'First Nations people comprise 30-40% of the employees' at a key diamond mine, but it's still entirely questionable where the money is really going, and how the jobs are divided (administrative vs hard labour).

The environmental issue is similar. Still, it must be said that Canada appears to be doing its part in participating in UN initiatives like the Kimberly Process. In print, it seems relatively honest. We need a documentarian to go to those mines and see what's really going on!

Welcome to the forums, ginginny!!!

As a long time lover and seller of turquoise I have to take exception to a couple of things you said.

IMO, all the so-called "Tibetan" turquoise is actually Chinese stone, mostly from Hubei province. True, the Tibetans love and use a lot of Coral and Turquoise but it is all imported to Tibet. The old Tibetan Turquoise Company at Zuni is an importer for Chinese turquoise. That's not to say there is anything wrong with Chinese turquoise. It runs the range from chalk to high grade stone, some of it very beautiful.

As to stabilized turquoise satisfying Arizona customers... I agree that folks in NM and AZ are much more knowledgeable about turquoise than most in other parts of the US. But I've seen a lot of very good stabilized turquoise worn by NM and AZ residents. Nugget strands, jaclas and heishi for example are almost always stabilized. Better quality (but not TOP quality) stone is much improved in hardness and color by stabilization or by the Foutz treatment. Since a high percentage of turquoise as it comes from the mines is too soft to use without stabilization I think it's unreasonably elitist and purist to accept only the very expensive natural stone as good enough to wear.

Man made block (all plastic) and dyed magnesite (It's NOT "chalk" turquoise - it's dyed magnesite) are better left to, as you call it, "fun" jewelry.
Just my [2c]

I had gone into an antique shop to look for tea cups. I was at the register paying foe my stuff when i looked down and saw the most beautiful 3 strand necklace made of bi-cone AB crystals in graduated sizes. I asked the clerk if i could look at it. The clasp was broken. I paid $5.00 for it!!!! These antique gems has turnes me sour to anything but the real thing. Another source for beads is the goodwill and such. I bought a pair of earrings for $1.00 andthe true value was $185.00!!!! I hope you all find this info useful.

My late husband, who held the Chair of Mediaeval Studies at a pretty decent university :-) made my engagement ring himself of silver and moonstones, partly inspired by mediaeval poetry and partly by Tolkien. When I saw it I knew why I was marrying the man - he never thought for a second I deserved the same cookie-cutter ring from a zillion high street jewellers.

Margi

Dear Margi,

Hi!

That is so lovely, so special. I think if I had been making jewellery when I got married I would have made something for Jeremy myself, we were both students when we married so money was to short for us to have anything made, next year we will have our 10th anniversary, so I may make something for that....

Love, Jan

Thanks for the welcome, Russ...

You are absolutely correct about the stabilized turquoise. I guess I "misspoke" by using generalities. Most turquoise requires some stabilization or treatment of some kind because of porosity. Another problem is that some turquoise will turn green over time if not treated for color retention. My point was really just to know what your customers want. Mine are turquoise snobs. :) Jeepers, even coral has its snobs. Try finding some red coral nowadays that has not been dyed. Then try to explain THAT to a coral snob!

I just try to steer clear of anything "questionable." That way, I don't have to answer too many questions! LOL

okay.... so what about Goldstone? I know that it is manmade and there is nothing "real" about it but my customers ALWAYS buy it! And some of it is a bit expensive (on my part) so would you guys consider this as one of the "gems" that a "snob" wouldn't wear????

I am so confused by this whole conversation!

Some "stones" have been in use so long in their man made or enhanced form that they are accepted as "real" stones by the buying public (and my many crafters.)

Goldstone, hematite, all red carnelian and black onyx are "OK" with most people.
Goldstone is glass with dissolved copper that precipitates or crystallizes out with a particular process. (It's NOT just colored glass.)
Hematite beads are nearly always the man made sintered product.
Red carnelian and black onyx are nearly always enhanced to become that solid a color.

In another thread I talk about how nearly all blue sapphires are heat treated to change the colorless or yellow corundum to blue.

The public is so used to these man made or enhanced stones that they are acceptable. (I've actually gotten in trouble with customers when I told them I was selling them an enhanced or man made stone. I've lost sales because because my customer would go to other vendors who didn't know or who were not being honest about their products.)

I think we can make jewelry from what ever catches our eye. For many customers at any price point it's the design and color that is important. It's our job to know what the materials are. It's our responsibility to disclose enhanced or man made products if we are selling in a manner that suggests they are real, natural stones. Educating our selves and educating our customers is an on going process.

I'll help where I can with our free on-line Gem Index that covers many stones and tells about the enhancements and imitations that we know about. It's not perfect. We are always making additions and corrections. It is one resource available to everyone on line. http://rings-things.com/gemstone/index.html

Ginginny: You CAN find natural, undyed coral but it's NOT cheap. R H Company in CA is one source. TBS, IJS and Rio usually have some sold from Gallup and Albuquerque since that is the center of the whole turquoise jewelry industry.